Modi Makes Candid Remarks on his First-ever Podcast: “I am Human and Prone to make Mistakes”
Manas Dasgupta
NEW DELHI, Jan 10: Offering a very different mantra for handling anxiety, the Prime Minister Narendra Modi has said while he did feel anxious, the position he holds necessitates him to control his emotions and one way of doing that is to counter restlessness by going along with one’s mission.
In a podcast with Nikhil Kamath, the co-founder of Zerodha, the Prime Minister cited examples of how he dealt with the 2002 Gujarat elections – which he called the biggest challenge of his life – blasts in the state and the Godhra train burning incident.
Mr Modi appeared on his first-ever podcast on Friday, where he touched upon many controversial topics, including the 2002 Godhra riots and the visa denial by the United States in 2005. Mr Modi told entrepreneur Nikhil Kamath that after he witnessed “that painful scene” of the Godhra train carnage, he “felt everything” but did everything to control his emotions because he was then the chief minister of Gujarat.
The podcast trailer was shared by PM Modi himself on X. “I hope you all enjoy this as much as we enjoyed creating it for you!” PM Modi wrote. “You see, to manage these things, everyone has his own ability and individual style… I hold such a position that I have to control my emotions — the natural tendency that human beings have, I will have to stay detached from all of that. I will have to rise above all that.
In a candid submission, Mr Modi said human beings do make mistakes and he too was susceptible to making mistakes as he was a human being. “Mistakes happen, and I too can make some. I am also a human, not god,” PM Modi told Mr Kamath. But he insisted that none of his actions have a “wrong intention.” “Human beings are prone to make mistakes, but it shouldn’t be at the cost of doing things with bad intentions.
“When I became the Chief Minister, I gave a speech in which I said I will not shy away from hard work and I will not do anything for myself and I am human who can make mistakes, but I will never do anything wrong with bad intentions. This is my life’s mantra,” the Prime Minister said during the podcast. “Everyone makes mistakes, including me. After all, I am a human being, not some God,” he added.
In his two-hour long podcast conversation, Mr Modi reflected on various aspects of his life and career. He shared insights into his childhood growing up in Gujarat, his journey in politics, and the significance of ideology and idealism in shaping his decisions. PM Modi also delved into the intricacies of policymaking and governance, discussed global conflicts, and emphasised the importance of youth participation in politics.
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He emphasised the importance of idealism over ideology, saying that even though politics can’t happen without ideology, idealism was very much required. The Prime Minister said that Gandhi and Savarkar had different paths, but their ideology was “freedom”.
“Idealism is far more important than ideology. Without ideology, politics can’t happen. However, idealism is very much required,” he said.
Recalling the Godhra train burning, PM Modi said he became an MLA for the first time on February 24, 2002. He went to the Assembly for the first time three days later, on February 27. “I had been an MLA for only three days. And, suddenly, I came to know about that big incident in Godhra. There was a fire on the train. I came to know, gradually, that people were dead. I was obviously very restless, I was worried. As soon as I came out of the Assembly, I said that I wanted to go to Godhra. So, I told them that we would go to Vadodara and take a helicopter from there. They said that there was no helicopter. I told them to arrange it from somewhere. I guess ONGC (Oil and Natural Gas Corporation) had one. It was a single-engine helicopter. They said they could not take a VIP. I said, ‘I am not a VIP. I am a common man. I will go’.”
The PM said there was a big fight and he offered to give in writing that he would take responsibility for whatever happened and he would go on the single-engine helicopter. “And I reached Godhra. Now, with that terrible sight… numerous dead bodies… you can imagine… I am also a human being, I also felt things. But I was aware that, being in this post… I have to stay detached from my emotions, my natural tendency as a human being. I have to rise above it all. And I did whatever I could to handle myself,” he recalled.
He said he saw painful scenes of dead bodies when he reached Godhra. “I reached Godhra, and I witnessed that painful scene, those dead bodies… I felt everything, but I knew that I was sitting in a position where I would have to stay out of my emotions and natural tendencies. I did whatever I could to control myself,” he told Kamath.
Mr Modi also recalled the United States’ denial of visa to him when he was the CM of Gujarat. “I was the MLA when the American government refused to give me a visa. As an individual, going to America was not a big thing, I had visited before also, but I felt the disrespect of an elected government and the country, and there was a dilemma in my mind as to what was happening… That day, I held a press conference, where I said that the American government had rejected my visa. I also said I see India, where the world will stand in the queue for visas. This is my statement in 2005 and today we are standing in 2025. So, I can see that now, the time belongs to India,” he added.
Mr Modi said the world trusts India because the country did not adhere to duplicity in global affairs. “The world trusts us, because there is no duplicity in us, whatever we say we say clearly. Even in these times of crisis, we have repeatedly said that we are not neutral. I am in favour of peace, and I will support whatever efforts are made towards it. I tell this to Russia, Ukraine, Iran, Palestine and Israel. They have faith in me, that what I am saying is right,” he added.
PM Modi also narrated the story of Chinese President Xi Jinping’s visit to Gujarat. “When I became the PM in 2014, leaders from across the world made courtesy calls… Chinese President Xi also made a courtesy call in which he said he wanted to come to India. I said: ‘You are welcome, you must visit’. He said ‘I want to visit Gujarat, your village Vadnagar… you know why? You and I share a special bond’… He said Chinese philosopher Hiuen Tsang resided the longest in your village and when he returned to China, he resided in ‘my village,” Mr Modi said.
About controlling his emotions, Mr Modi said “In 2002, there were elections in Gujarat. It was the biggest challenge of my life… I never watched TV and didn’t check the results,” the PM said. “At 11:00 am or noon, I heard the beat of drums outside the chief minister’s bungalow. I had told everyone not to inform me till 12 pm. Then our operator sent me a letter saying I was leading with a two-thirds majority. So, I don’t believe that nothing affected me that day, but I had a thought to overpower that feeling. You can say that there was restlessness and anxiety inside me,” he explained.
Talking about bomb blasts in Gujarat, the Prime Minister, who was the chief minister of the state at the time, said he visited hospitals and the police control room despite his security team asking him not to.
“There were bombings in five places. You can imagine my situation, being the Chief Minister of the state. So, I said I wanted to go to the police control room. But my security team refused. They said, ‘Sir, it will be unsafe for you to go’. I said, ‘Whatever happens will happen, I will go’. They were very worried. Finally, I sat in the car. I said I would go to the hospital first. They said there were bombings in the hospitals too. I said again, ‘Whatever happens, I will go’. You can say that there was restlessness and anxiety inside me. But my approach was that I would go along with my mission. Maybe I experience that in a different way. I feel a sense of responsibility towards it,” he said.
Mr Modi said when he interacts with students during ‘Pariksha Pe Charcha’ events, he tells them to treat exams as a routine activity and act accordingly. Asked whether his style of thinking was that he would take worst-case scenarios into account, the Prime Minister said, “I have never thought of life or death. This is probably for people who live life in a calculated manner. Perhaps I will not be able to answer this. Because, wherever I am today, I had never planned for that… When I became a chief minister, I was surprised how I became one. So, I had never chosen this path for myself. I have got a responsibility, I am doing it. Doing it well is my objective. But I didn’t start off with this in mind.
“That is why I don’t know how to calculate. It happens in ordinary life. Perhaps I am an exception. Because my background is such that I can never think like that. My background is such that if I had become a primary school teacher, my mother would have distributed sweets in the locality. She would have said, ‘See, my son has become a teacher’. That is why I never had such aspirations. I never thought, ‘If this doesn’t happen, then what?’ I don’t burden myself with such thoughts,” he added.
Reacting to Mr Modi’s “I’m not a god” remark in the podcast, the Congress MP Jairam Ramesh said the statement is coming from the Prime Minister who had “proclaimed his non-biological status” before the 2024 Lok Sabha election.
Ramesh was referring to a remark by Modi in an interview that he had been “sent by God.” “This from a man who proclaimed his non-biological status just eight months back. This is clearly damage control,” Ramesh wrote on X, while sharing a clip of PM Modi’s old interview.
In an interview with a television network before the 2024 Lok Sabha elections, Mr Modi had said God had sent him with “ability, strength, pure-heartedness and inspiration.” “Until my mother was alive, I used to think I was born biologically. After her demise, when I look at my experiences, I am convinced that I was sent by God. This strength is not from my body. It has been given to me by God. That’s why God also gave me the ability, strength, pure-heartedness, and inspiration to do this. I’m nothing but an instrument that God has sent,” PM Modi had said.
