Manas Dasgupta
NEW DELHI, Mar 16: Prime Minister Narendra Modi has lambasted Pakistan for adopting inimical attitude against India right from the beginning pointing out that every attempt made by India to foster peace with Pakistan was met with hostility and betrayal.
He said he could only hope that wisdom would prevail on the leadership in Islamabad to improve bilateral ties.
In a massively popular global podcast hosted by US computer scientist and podcaster Lex Fridman released on Sunday, Mr Modi recalled that he had specially invited his Pakistan counterpart Nawaz Sharif for his swearing-in ceremony in 2014 with the hope that the two countries could turn a new leaf.
The three-hour-long podcast has been shared in many languages with subtitles, including Hindi, while the original podcast was recorded in a mix of Hindi and English. A wonderful conversation with @lexfridman, covering a wide range of subjects. Do watch! Mr Modi also wrote on his handle.
“Yet, every noble attempt at fostering peace was met with hostility and betrayal. We sincerely hope that wisdom prevails upon them and they choose the path of peace,” the Prime Minister said. Mr Modi said he believed that even the people of Pakistan long for peace because they also must be tired of living in strife, unrest and relentless terror where even innocent children are killed and countless lives are destroyed.
The Prime Minister said his first attempt at improving bilateral relations was a gesture of goodwill when he invited the then Pakistan prime minister Nawaz Sharif for his swearing-in in 2014 after his electoral victory. “It was a diplomatic gesture unlike any in decades. The very people who once questioned my approach to foreign policy were taken aback when they learned I had invited all SAARC heads of state and our then President Pranab Mukherjee beautifully captured that historic gesture in his memoir,” Mr Modi said.
“This was a testament to how clear and confident India’s foreign policy had become. This sent a clear message to the world about India’s commitment to peace and harmony, but we didn’t get the desired outcome,” Mr Modi told Mr Fridman, whose X handle has 4.2 million followers.
PM Modi said everyone from what is now known as Pakistan and India fought “side by side, shoulder to shoulder” during the struggle for Independence. “I would like to delve into periods of our history the world may be unfamiliar with. Before 1947, during the struggle for Independence, everyone was fighting side by side, shoulder to shoulder. And the nation was eagerly waiting to celebrate the freedom, the joy of Independence. Now, we could have a lengthy discussion on what led to the events that unfolded. But the fact remains that the policymakers of the time agreed to India’s partition,” PM Modi said.
“And they agreed to the Muslim side’s demand of carving out a separate nation. With hearts weighed down by grief and silent tears, Indians embraced this painful reality. However, what unfolded was an immediate, heart-breaking saga of bloodshed. Trains filled with bloodied, wounded people and corpses started arriving from Pakistan. It was a harrowing sight. After getting their own way, we expected them to live and let live. And yet, they chose not to foster a harmonious coexistence. Time and again they decided to be at odds with India. They have waged a proxy war against us,” the prime minister said.
He said Pakistan’s behaviour should not be mistaken for ideology. “What kind of ideology thrives on bloodshed and the export of terror? And we are not the sole victims of this menace. Wherever terror strikes in the world, the trail somehow leads to Pakistan. Let’s take the September 11 attacks for example,” PM Modi said, referring to how Osama bin Laden was found hiding in a house in Pakistan.
“The mastermind behind it, Osama bin Laden, where did he eventually emerge? He took shelter in Pakistan, the world saw that. So in a way terrorism and the terrorist mindset are deeply rooted in Pakistan. Today, it [Pakistan] stands as an epicentre of turmoil, not just for India, but for the world. And we have repeatedly asked them what good can come from this path? We have urged them to abandon the path of state-sponsored terrorism for good,” the prime minister said.
“Yet, every noble attempt at fostering peace was met with hostility and betrayal. We sincerely hope that wisdom prevails upon them and they choose the path of peace. I believe even the people of Pakistan long for peace because they must be weary of living in strife and unrest,” PM Modi said.
Mr Modi also shared his thoughts on the controversial Godhra train carnage and the subsequent communal riots in Gujarat in 2002 when he was the chief minister of the state. He said the 2002 Sabarmati Express attack in Gujarat’s Godhra was a “tragedy of unimaginable magnitude” and the riots that followed this “was tragic for everyone.” He also said the riots that took place, contrary to perception, were not the worst that Gujarat has seen. Nor has there been any communal tension in the state since.
PM Modi said a fake narrative was spread around the Godhra case. Before 2002, Gujarat had witnessed over 250 riots, and communal violence was frequent. The world had seen a surge in terrorist activities and violence during those times. However, since 2002, not a single case of riots has occurred in Gujarat. He also highlighted that people tried to malign his image after the riots but ultimately, justice prevailed and the courts cleared his name.
Describing the backdrop in which the events took place, he named the Kandahar hijack, the 9/11 attack in the US, attacks on the J&K Assembly and parliament. These events, he said, had “created the background.” “In such a tense environment, even the smallest spark can ignite unrest. The situation had already become extremely volatile,” he said.
Then he was handed the responsibility of leading Gujarat as its Chief Minister amid the massive quake in Kutch and the rehabilitation efforts that followed. “This was a crucial task, and from day one after my oath, I immersed myself in it. I was a person who had absolutely no prior experience with government. I had never been part of any administration, never even served in government before. I had never contested an election, never even been a State Representative.
“For the first time in my life, I had to face elections. On February 24, 2002, I became a State Representative, an elected representative, for the first time. And it was only around February 24th, 25th, or 26th that I stepped into the Gujarat Assembly for the very first time. On February 27, 2002, we were seated in the assembly for the budget session, and that same day, it had been just three days since I’d become a State Representative, when suddenly, the horrific Godhra incident occurred,” he said.
It was a “tragedy of unimaginable magnitude, people were burned alive,” PM Modi said. “You can imagine, against the backdrop of incidents like the Kandahar hijacking, the attack on Parliament, or even 9/11, and then to have so many people killed and burned alive… You can imagine how tense and volatile the situation was. Of course, this was tragic for everyone, everyone prefers peace,” he said.
Summing up, he said, “So there was a long history long before I was in the picture. But that one tragic incident in 2002 became a sparking point, leading some people towards violence. Yet, the judiciary thoroughly investigated the matter. At that time, our political opponents were in power, and naturally, they wanted all allegations against us to stick.” But “despite their relentless efforts, the judiciary analyzed the situation meticulously, twice, and ultimately, found us completely innocent. Those who were truly responsible have faced justice from the courts,” he added.
The perception that that the 2002 riot was the biggest ever is actually misinformation, PM Modi said. “If you review the data from before 2002, you’ll see that Gujarat faced frequent riots, curfews were constantly being imposed somewhere. Communal violence could erupt over trivial issues, like kite-flying contests or even minor bicycle collisions. Before 2002, Gujarat witnessed over 250 significant riots. The riots in 1969 lasted nearly six months,” he said.
But in the years since, there has not been a single instance of communal violence in the state, he said. With the policy of “Sabka Saath, sabka vikaas, sabka Vishwas”, the politics of appeasement has been changed into politics of development, he said.
On his relations with the current US administration, Mr Modi said he shared a bond of mutual trust with President Donald Trump and they connect well because they believe in putting their respective national interests above everything else. Mr Modi hailed Mr Trump as a man of courage, who took his own decisions, was unwaveringly dedicated to the United States and the same spirit was on display when he was shot at by a gunman on the election campaign trail last year.
The Prime Minister said President Trump appeared far more prepared than before in his second term. “He has a clear roadmap in his mind with well-defined steps, each one designed to lead him toward his goals,” Mr Modi said on Mr Trump’s second term as President.
The Prime Minister said he had the chance to meet members of Mr Trump’s team during his recent visit to the U.S. “I truly believe he has put together a strong, capable group. And with such a strong team, I feel they are fully capable of implementing President Trump’s vision,” Mr Modi said.
He recalled his meetings with Vice President J.D. Vance, Director of National Intelligence Tulsi Gabbard, Vivek Ramaswamy and Elon Musk. The Prime Minster recalled the ‘Howdy Modi’ community event at the packed NRG Stadium in Houston in September 2019 and how Mr Trump listened to his speech by sitting among the audience. “Now, that’s his humility. The President of the United States sitting in the audience while I spoke from the stage, that was a remarkable gesture on his part,” Mr Modi said.
The Prime Minister also recalled how the U.S. security detail went into a tizzy when he casually asked Trump to take a round of the packed stadium to greet the audience and he had agreed without hesitation. “His entire security detail was thrown off guard, but for me that moment was truly touching. It showed me that this man had courage. He makes his own decisions, but also he trusted me and my lead in that moment enough to have walked with me into the crowd,” he said.
“It was that sense of mutual trust, a strong bond between us that I truly witnessed on that day. And the way I saw President Trump that day walking into a crowd of thousands without even asking security, it was truly amazing,” the Prime Minister said.
Mr Modi said he saw the same resilient and determined Mr Trump when he was shot at during the U.S. election campaign. “Even after being shot, he remained unwaveringly dedicated to America. His life was for his nation. This showed his America First spirit, just as I believe in ‘India first,” the Prime Minister said.
“I stand for India first and that’s why we connect so well. These are the things that truly resonate,” Mr Modi said. The Prime Minister said politicians across the world get so much media coverage that people mostly perceive them through its lens. “People rarely get the chance to truly meet or personally know one another and perhaps third-party intervention is the real cause of tensions,” Mr Modi said.